Freight Friends: Tech Mergers, Logistics SEO, and Market Shifts

Mergers and acquisitions are reshaping the logistics tech landscape. In this episode of Freight Friends, Blythe and Grace Sharkey unpack what recent deals mean for the industry, how SEO strategies are shifting under AI pressure, and what freight markets could look like in the coming months. They also explore the ripple effects for carriers, shippers, and the tech companies caught in the middle. 

Key takeaways: 

• Tech consolidation is reshaping how freight companies compete and collaborate. 
• SEO strategies in logistics are changing fast with AI and shifting consumer behavior. 
• Carriers and shippers are feeling the pressure of an uncertain second half of 2025. 
• Market moves today will set the tone for 2026 freight demand and technology adoption.

LINKS:

• Grace’s Linktree
• FreightGames.io
• "Flexport Tycoon"
• LinkedIn post on Instagram SEO
• Cloudflare fighting against the LLM bots

WATCH THE FULL EPISODE HERE

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Chapters

• 5:37 Why Mergers Are Heating Up in 2025
• 11:17 Flexport, Convoy, and Strategic Exits
• 18:40 The Data Integration Headache in M&A
• 24:20 Which Companies Are Worth Watching
• 30:00 Trucking Consolidation and Driver Realities
• 35:50 What These Moves Mean for Freight’s Future

Transcript

Unknown: 0:37

You.

Blythe Milligan: 0:42

Let's get into our first segment, and that is talking about all of the different Mergers Acquisitions that have been happening so far in 2025 rumors are there's more on the way. It's not going to be slowing down. So Grace, you have covered freight tech for years. Obviously, you previously work with freightwaves. Now you're over at another freight tech company with orderful. So give us sort of the the high level overview of what the hell is happening with all these mergers and acquisitions.

Grace Sharkey: 1:14

Yeah, you know, I think it's interesting. I think companies are starting to use this time period for these really interesting strategic mergers, right, looking for really areas that you want to improve in your business, and finding that company that you can pick up and help accelerate you to those goals. I mean,

Unknown: 1:33

before we started recording, we just talked about, you know, convoy, once again, making money for another company, and, well, at least for Flexport in this situation, right? And how it was recently sold to to d 80. And I think for dat, you pick up convoy, and the more technological advancements that come with it for them to, I think more modernize that their freight tech stack that they have over there, bring on those team members and continue to innovate, you've seen a number of brokers, logistics providers. Freightways has covered a ton of these that have been buying either assets, trucking companies or even offices in different regions around the country. I mean, when you're talking about a period of where we've seen broker margins at their lowest, trucking companies, especially at their lowest in terms of what they're hoping to bring in. And then honestly, tech companies, and tech companies who have investors who want to see a return somewhere, these type of plays are going to happen more frequently. So I'm excited to see that, along with the heat of the summer, we've seen the heat of good old acquisitions and mergers as well. And we're starting to see a ramp up, I think of even investment too. I think good ship just announced a nice $25 million raise. Think was it motive like had over $100 million something like that a week or so ago. So the money is back flowing. But I think what we have seen from the merger side is that a lot of I would assume these board members investors want to see a little bit more of a strategy of where that return is going to come from. And I think these are showcasing, okay, these opportune moments to to maybe let an asset go that's not really helping you directly look at something maybe like Flexport and get handing that over to someone who could use that technology. Well, especially with with Flexport, when they bought convoy like it was almost like, you know, nickels, nickels on the dollar, of what they were paying for. But then they flipped it and sold it for hundreds of millions of dollars. Yes, uh, rumored, but yes, yeah, something along those lines. And I think maybe Peterson had been given a little bit more guidance on that too, but yeah, exactly right. And I'm sure they, they learned a lot from that acquisition too. Yeah, you know, you you fix it, you turn the company around, and it becomes something that's available out there to sell. And I think there's probably a lot of technology just within all the integrations that we see between tech companies, right? A lot of I wouldn't be surprised if we see maybe more of like these TMS is picking up some of these technologies in particular and putting them into their freight tech stack permanently, permanently. I think there's, I mean, interesting enough. I I've heard rumors, but, you know, we'll put this out there. It's not that crazy. I've heard rumors that, you know, highways looking to raise money. But there's also, you know, some interesting opportunities they're looking at too. So I don't know, I think it's, it's that strategy time. I think when you look back maybe four or five years ago, and it really got hot in this space, people were getting all the money in the world. Money was free. That's not happening. The feds aren't moving on much these days either, and there's not much clarity of when you know interest rates will get better. So let's do the most with what we have on board. And how can we, you know, in Flex sports case, right, flip this and make some money as well. It almost sounds like because I believe there's three more fed meetings for the rest of this year, and we could potentially, I was just listening to a podcast this morning. Was talking about how we could potentially see rate cuts in all three of those different meetings, which would be fantastic for the market, because then that does free up some money. But from just looking at some of these different acquisitions, I mean, just in May, we had dat purchase outgo, dat purchase convoy, um, project 61 just purchased off shift. So that's Mark manera. Is company for driver health. And really, like, I think his mission is more like overall supply chain health, and, you know, not just for for truck drivers, but also warehouse workers and just any kind of folks working within logistics. So that was a cool one to see triumph in back in May purchase green screens. I think they're now all, you know, part of the the same umbrella companies. But I think, which is kind of kind of sucks at green screens brand like it's going away. But I understand these things happen during purchase acquisitions, but hopefully we'll still see, you know, maybe at future conferences, they'll still wear, like, you know, the green Hawaiian shirts at all those different events. And, you know, they got their green shoes and all that. I just, I love that branding that they did from from them, Descartes, purchase, three, three GTM. Is that how you pronounce it? Three. I see GTM and I read, go to market, but three, just three gtms, right? Or something like that. Three gtms. Oh, that makes sense, because I see GTM and I'm like, go to market. Like, is that a marketing company? Sorry, marketing brain. There's a couple of other ones here. NFI, purchase, transfix, Nuvo, cargo. Purchase, merge, transportation, stored. Purchase, where to go. So a lot of these amounts are undisclosed, so we don't necessarily know the specific dollar amount. Then there was a bunch of other ones that are just on, you know, like, almost like the big ship lines and things like that. So those kind of companies have been making a lot of purchasing, forward air purchasing, Omni logistics, y set global purchasing. E, to open, I had, you know, in case you're wondering, I had grok do, like, a deep research report of all of the different mergers and acquisitions and logistics and supply chain, but then it came back with this report that only had like 10 companies. And I'm like, no, no, there's, there's a lot more. There's triumph, there's green screens, there's debt. And I, I almost like, bullied grock into doing a completely new research report. So it added all of those additional ones. So we have a lot of, like, tech focused and brokerage deals, which is what we I kind of just outlined. But then there's other major deals, just by I mean, billions of dollars, DSV purchase, DB, schnick, is that how you say that? Yeah, for almost $16 billion there are freight forwarding and contract logistics giant, creating a top global provider with enhanced networks. I wonder if it would be helpful to share my screen here, but I kind of outline, you know, a lot of like the the big ones like forward air purchase Omnia logistics. I know there's some others, like stuff going on with forward air too. I don't know if that, if somebody else is trying to buy forward air as well. It's the point is, is that there's a lot of movement and shaking going on within this industry, and it feels like some kind of capital is starting to get a little bit loosened up with the anticipation of rate cuts later this year. It looks like a lot of these companies, especially D 80, you know, kind of putting, you know, a lot of like, different chess pieces on the board. Are there any, I guess, maybe trends that you're kind of seeing, or maybe, like implications of of some of these deals and mergers going through. Like, do you see more consolidation in the future? Or do you, do you see this is kind of making room for more niche players. I think just more consolidation. I think hopefully, maybe because of that, the niche players get a little bit more spotlight from investors, right? Knowing, okay, there's a potential for really good exit right in what they're doing. So if you are, for example, I know I'm creating some type of technology that's helpful and oversized shipping, right? An investor might be more open to that investment, seeing that there's more of an exit strategy for that nuance type. And I think that's really what you've learned even from like the DB one that you brought up as well. A lot of this is like, how can we work with partners? I think that's one that's always why I'm always interested in a lot of these, like partner news releases. Because on the surface it might just be like, Oh, here's like a PR instance, but it's also a potential for in the future, an acquisition in that space too, I think, or even the movement of something like transfix, right? So transfix, you brought up the NFI stuff. Well, if you follow transfixes past history, you know, they, at one point, they set aside and said, Hey, listen, I believe they pushed off their brokerage unit and became tech only. Right? Whenever I see a move like that, it's because likely they're looking for a more strategic exit, right? I think another one. Could probably look at not saying that they are doing anything but ship Well, right? They ended up pushing their brokerage off to cloud trucks, which is great for cloud trucks, right? They need that piece likely to fuel more loads to get to their carriers, to make their business model work. I'm sure that's great for their investors. On the other side. Shipwell wants to do what they're good at, which is make really great technology. They don't want to broker loads. And so you get rid of that headache, and you focus on what you're good at, which you see often in kind of like the TMS space, I think a lot of companies realize when they first start, oh, we kind of have to have this, like, behind the scenes, brokerage arms to like, showcase this technology works, and then as it grows and as the technology gets better, there's less of a reason for it. So I I think going to back to like, what we might potentially see. I definitely think you're going to see more of these strategic pickups, the things that allow them to expand into different regions in particular. Wouldn't be surprised if we see a little bit more action in US logistics picking up even more of like these European countries in particular, or just companies that are a little bit more globally focused in logistics to open up that category as well. But yeah, it's, it's, that's what's fun about kind of following companies and knowing what they're good at, what they're not good at, and what that can mean for their future as well. And triumph, right? A couple of times. I mean, they've that's one, if you read graphs, letters to investors that he writes every earnings period, he basically tells you exactly in there what his their their motive is, and with a lot of these acquisitions, is because they are realizing that, I think the structure of how just their factoring service works, even like with their hub, Tran and more of like that, factoring service focus they've done, I don't think it's bringing as much value to the company as it could what it's doing now with its intelligence unit offering. Hey, listen, we have all this data flowing in. Why would we have our customers outsource to different data companies with all that's here, and we can explore the same thing with them, or, even more so do what they're doing, like with ch Robinson and offering this like white labeled factoring service, right? We have all everything in house to make that happen. So that's listen to. I always like to listen, at least for the public companies that have to tell you what their hope is for the future, and that will kind of showcase to you what likely they'll pick up, or what they're looking to acquire over time. I it's just, I can't imagine that these types of mergers are I'm not even saying that or implying that it's going to be easy, but I'm just thinking of, like, my own, like, sort of company data needs and to integrate another company, another sop, or probably has tons of SOPs, maybe they have, like, you know, their own data structure, and importing that and integrating that into, God, that's such a heavy lift. So hey, thank you for touching that. Because you know what, it is, a heavy headache, and that's why you need a top of the line EDI provider. And here order, you opened up the pitch for me, I'm going to swing at it here at orderful, we can help you with that. I mean, that's actually a lot of times too. We talk to people pain points of mergers and acquisitions. Is, yeah, hey, how is that data transfer between companies? So go check us out, orderful.com but listen, you hit on a customer pain point. I wasn't going to let it go. We got bills to pay over here. David, we're going to get these shout outs mentioned as much as possible, because, I mean to I just can't imagine that headache. I mean, just looking at my own data and try it. Just trying to, like, for example, right now, I'm trying to build out, and I've had this on the back burner for years. I want, like, a CEO marketing dashboard where I can take a look at each of my different brands, and I can see what the funnel looks like, and I can see, you know, what's gathering attention for the podcast, and does that, you know, transfer into, you know, meetings booked for the products I'm advertising, and some of them are my own products, some of them are sponsor products. And so, how do I prove value for the content that we're creating, and then try to have room for shows like this, where it is, like, it's not, you know, strictly business driven. This is a lot of fun for me to, you know, make this show and host it with you, but I still need to pay the bills with, like, other types of content. And so just trying. To do that simple thing. It's quote, unquote simple of pulling in my x analytics, pulling in my LinkedIn analytics, pulling in email marketing, pulling them all into the same place, is incredibly difficult, because everybody uses different data structures, and companies will measure views and follows at a different level. For example, a view on Facebook is three seconds. A view on Instagram is three seconds. You don't need to have the audio on somebody could just be glancing or just stroll a scroll a little too slow, and if they're on there for three seconds, that counts as a view on YouTube, it's 30 seconds. On LinkedIn, I think it's 10 seconds, but again, you don't have to have the audio on. And so it's like having these different data points. And who defines those data points is so just different. And so I cannot imagine what that looks like, integrating another company like D, a T, for example, integrating Alka, or, you know, getting green screens data, which I'm sure green screens does an impeccable job with, like their data structure, but it could be completely different than the way that triumph does it. And so honestly, it's like, hey, shout out. If there's a convoy worker who has survived the transition from convoy to Flexport, from Flexport to t he or she. If you're out there and you survived, let us know we will have you on the show, because war stories, all right. Well, well, just to, just to round out, you know this part of the conversation I mentioned earlier about that grok deep research report that conducted and kind of edited a little bit, but it talks about implications for technology in these industries, and it says these M and A signal a tech driven future with consolidations enabling investments in AI, automation and sustainability, drink, every time you hear or see those words and any company's marketing, but they have five key takeaways here. So one of those is AI and digital platform surge. So acquisitions like wise tech, ETU open and triumph green screens prioritize AI for pricing. So they're talking a little bit about on the integrated side of things. Could create smart ecosystems with a blockchain for visibility, another drink every time you hear the word visibility. Number two on the list is supply chain, resilience and efficiency. I'm not going to read through each of these descriptions, but number three, sustainability and green tech. Number four, human centric innovations, which I thought was an interesting one around project 61 and off shift, because it highlights Health Tech for drivers, using AI coaching to combat shortages. I don't know if that's right grok, because there's technically never a truck driver shortage, right? And then improve safety via wearables and telematics. And then rounding out the list at number five is challenges. So market concentration risk, antitrust issues, while over reliance on tech exposes cybersecurity vulnerabilities, tariff uncertainties may accelerate localized AI optimized chains. Job shifts towards tech skills will require training. Thank you, grok for that. Added little note to that. I don't know how I don't really get anything from the implications of technology for these industries in this particular section, I think you actually explained it a lot better that it sounds like from a high level view, and correct me if I'm wrong, but that a lot of these bigger companies have been sitting on a ton of cash for about a year now. They're waiting for the market to kind of shift things out. I think budgets ran really dry during like the March to June timeframe. But then, you know, these things are starting to come out of the woodwork. Now, deals are starting to get finalized. So maybe they've been working behind the scenes for a while, setting up the chessboard in order to kind of dominate for 2026 and beyond. Is there anything you would add on to that. The one thing I would say is maybe not so much, that I wouldn't say so much that they're sitting on cash. I think they're being strategic right on how they're coming up with that, whether it's, you know, the I think a lot of it, a lot of times, when you see these acquisitions, right, there's some type of stipulation or goals that you have to hit as the acquired company in order to get the payouts Right. So there's probably some just, like, really, I mean, there's some really aggressive terms in that, so that people can make good money out of it. I think it's more so with the positivity. I think we're at that positive turn where it's like, It can't get much worse, knowing that, okay, we're at the bottom right. Like, if you're buying stock, you're gonna buy at the bottom. You're gonna, you know, sell when it's at the top. And I think it's a little bit of more, that situation is okay. Where can we be strategic with terms right now? Where, what can we dilute in order? To find, you know, maybe the the liquid to make some of these acquisitions. I just think it's, there's enough proof that the the market is turning. I've even got, trust me, I get calls from a lot of people nowadays that's, you know, how can we get into it? And I think it's that, that moment has come, and the rest is, we can figure out the tariffs, I mean, and even to be honest with you, right, like in a worst case, we're probably at a three years away from a solution. If this doesn't figure out itself right with the elections and stuff, they know that there's going to be a positive turn around if you had to, not investment advice, but if you had to buy stock in any of these companies, not saying all of them are publicly traded or anything. Who would you buy stock in? Hmm, you know what? Let me i so it's so it's funny that you asked that. I think because you also have to think about, well, when's the return? Um, I think it's Roper, right, that that owns d a t, that one could be potentially a good one, but that ropers package involves a lot of things outside of just d a t triumph. I'm not sure they're going to see that return very anytime soon. So there's a I'd like to see how the next, like, year or so goes. I think maybe there's sorry triumph, because I love you as a team. If I'm being honest, there might like still be a time for that to fall, I think, in all of this. But I think for oh, here's a perfect one. It's probably too late, because the news is already out, but siege Robinson has been upgraded by moody. That's one, if you were to ask me this question, even yesterday, I probably would have said yes to that, and then moody read my mind and then published that right? So that's how that worked. But I think that they, I know their leadership that's focused on technology, I think they're sorry employees at ch Robinson, they're doing really good job at doing more with not hiring more people or firing people at the same time. That's great business. Again. That's the funny thing about like public companies is like their shareholders are who they answer to. So Sorry again, employees, but realize where you are in the circle of life. That's one I'm excited to see grow probably even ups too, right? As they get rid of some of their poor performers and focus on others and maybe an UPS, I think is a perfect example of how some of these acquisitions could go wrong, and then you're out there trying to flip them out at the same time, right? So, yeah, I think probably CH and ups are ones I would, I would look at right now and then go from there. But like the Triumph one, I kind of want to watch it a little bit, because I think they've done a lot of acquiring, and you're right. Let's make sure technology and Trimble, actually, Trimble's one, I think, has a really, yeah, but Trimble is also been like the Trimble curse, right, where it's acquired a lot of stuff that's done absolutely nothing for them, because, I think, of how they manage those acquisitions and and they kind of kept them separate, but now they're, I think, doing what they should have done to begin with, which is like combining all the technical and thought, I think that leadership at Trimble right now understands where they need to improve better than they have. So that's one I'm excited to watch grow too that I probably wouldn't have said a couple years ago. I think some of these too it I was looking at, you know, some of the other notable deals in this research report, and it's a lot of like, just buying different trucking companies. So I think we haven't even really touched on that during this discussion, where you're essentially, you know, buying assets, hopefully you're buying good drivers that are included in that which, you know, is a really drive. There's no driver shortage, but there is a really big problem with driver recruitment. So getting good drivers through the door and keeping them at your company has been the gold standard, in my opinion, for, you know, the last decade. And so when I see like, you know, Schneider acquired Cowen systems, AP, not that doesn't really count UPS acquired freego Trans and BPL, which is a German company, so that's like the cold chain healthcare, but related, because that happened in January, but in March. DHL, group, based in Germany, acquired cryo PDP, which is a France based company, for 195 million but that's another temperature controlled healthcare logistics. So, you know, especially with like, UPS versus DHL, very like similar competitors there, but the investments into the healthcare side of things, I think, is really interesting. So for a lot of like, the time sensitive freight, temperature sensitive freight. Uh, there's usually a rush charge, you know, around that. And so you can deal with, like, a bunch of different, probably, delivery mechanisms, whether it's like a helicopter or a drone or private air flights, you know, just for specific health care related needs. I think that that's that's really interesting. And then it was writer systems acquired Cardinal logistics back in February 2024 so that's a little bit, you know, a little almost a year and a half ago. But that's, you know, just, I'm a little, I guess, less bullish on, like acquiring the trucking side of things, because just margins are so tight and it's so tough. But maybe that's a future, like asset play, where you're just buying the assets for right now, you're you're essentially looping in the really good drivers and solving maybe a recruitment problem as well. And like we kind of mentioned with the freight tech companies, like setting up the chess pieces on the board. So then that way, you know, assets, that story is probably simple, which is, they're not making shit. Thanks for on the show. Yeah, yeah. I think YouTube realized for after five minutes, they let you go. So we've been on for more than five minutes. We're good there. I mean, you're you're just buying assets at a discount at this point right like, there's a couple of Michigan companies I've heard of recently. There's a big one right now, it's gonna piss me off that's actually going through the same thing. They're getting picked up. I think they're financially struggling. So instead, you know, a lot of these owners probably looking at, okay, maybe it's time I retire. Let me sell this thing off. And I assume that a lot of these companies are picking them up for the low much like yellow, right? Like it has been the toughest trucking market, I think, that we've seen in decades. And so for a lot of these companies that have been around for a long time, you know, lawsuits, insurance. I just saw is Carol fuller. Carol Fuller, that trucking company. It's a Florida based trucking company. They've been around for like, 70 plus years. There's actually, I believe one of the owners is on Tiktok, like, documenting, like, what's happening during her company closure right now. It's really, I don't want to say fascinating, because it's not fascinating for someone to lose their family job that they've had for decades in the family. I think that's incredibly tragic and heartbreaking, but it is a peek behind the curtain of being able to see what happens when. And she credits in the video, she's like rising lawsuits. You know, you got these billboard chasing law firms that want to target, maliciously, target trucking companies, and one lawsuit can really, you know, put you out of business, especially for a company, or not especially but a company that's been around for 70 plus years, like that. There's a whole lot of turmoil, turmoil happening in that realm. And if you don't know how to run trucks. You don't keep them well maintained. You don't know how to, you know, manage a proper safety department and get ahead of a lot of these things. And plus, you know, recruit the best drivers and hope that they perform well. It's a lot of different moving parts in the trucking side of things. So I could see where there's, you know, going to be further consolidation happening in the next six months, I would probably say there's gonna be more consolidation on the trucking side of things and maybe any other segment and logistics that you think it's a fair statement. I totally agree. I think you might see a little bit of these. I mean, if I was a broker right now looking for assets like this, would be the time I'm kind of watching for that. And you're 100% right. I just found the one you're talking about in Florida. And actually, the story does kind of remind me a little bit of what's happening in the company up here in Michigan too. They've got, you know, lawsuits from accidents going on, and it's on top of the margin. I mean, imagine that's why I always tell people, like, when they're like, I want to get into trucking. I'm like, Do you know what the operating ratio of a trucking company is? Because it's not great and and so, yeah, I think we'll probably see more of these assets move around, a lot of consolidation, which does suck for the small guys, I think, but could potentially be good for the small guys once the market does turn around. Yeah. I mean, maybe it frees you up from some cash, or maybe it gives you some additional runway so you can make it to a point where rates start to improve. But, you know, I'm sure everybody has heard this stat ad nauseum, but you know, 90% of all the fleets in the country are seven trucks or less, and I think it's actually that stat is a little bit higher. So when you hear about these big acquisitions, just know that there's, you know, a good portion of the market is seven trucks or fewer, and they're running super tight margins too. And so, you know, I guess if you run a profitable company, trucking company right now, like kudos to you, hopefully you can kind of hang on until the market comes. Rex, or if you're just tired, I think that's, you know, sort of the that, like the tone I get from, like trucking subreddits that Carol Fulmer post, people are just tired, and they're, they're worn out, and they, you know, another company comes through and they want to offer you a lot of money and you can take a break. Like I'd listen if that was some of these folks, you know, if I'm a Boomer and I know that I have Social Security, I would have taken and run, you know, I think it's a lot of that, though, I think it's this older generation of like, okay, this isn't what it used to be. I'm not making the amount of money I was. I might not be able. And there's nothing wrong with not being able to understand the difference of the market today. And that's just like again, circle of life. So why not take this check now? Retire responsibly. Pay all my drivers. You know, get something good. Make sure everyone goes home happy. Make sure that they have a good family. They're going to as well. A lot of these companies, the drivers stay, they just go to the new company, right? So I think that a lot of is, you know, I mean, you get it as close of a family unit, a lot of trucking companies are, I'm sure a lot of this has to do also with, alright, if I'm gonna have to forcely exit this market, let me just make sure my family is going into good hands, especially your your family's going into good hands, and that whoever acquires you can also pay the companies that you you know, you still owe on the books. That that was when the company I worked at closed down that was the biggest gripe to me, is that, you know, there was a specialized company that came in, like an accounting firm, lawyer firm, a hybrid of the two, to try to save the company. But then, after the fact, what they were doing, when all of you know the the executives and the employees are gone, there's really only that's left is like this one company that's responsible for managing the accounts payable and receivables, and at one point, what they were doing is having some of the accounting team like lie and say, No, send the check here instead of sending it to the carrier. And so these carriers were not getting paid, and that's what caused a lot of, like, the remaining accounting employees to just quit, because they, you know, just from like, a moral standpoint, it was wrong, and it's but this company, the one that was brought in to help save the company, was the one that was leeching off of these like Final payments, horrible company. I'm not going to name them because I frankly, can't remember their name off the top of my head, but I remember that I would, I would never invite that into my company, and I hope that's not happening, you know, across the the name, fortunately, I'm sure it probably is. But taking care of your drivers, taking care of the bills that you owe, taking care of like, especially like smaller like contractors and things like that, that should be the utmost importance, because those people can't wait months for, you know, litigation to figure itself out. And so hopefully, you know, there's a priority list of the companies who can manage a little bit more of a runway versus the people who can't, and that's your carriers. That's your, you know, sort of in the trenches employees. That tends to be the people who get the shaft the most when a trucking company faces like financial burden. So that's my little, I guess, soapbox that I'll get off of, because it really has nothing to do with the greater scope of what we're talking about, which is what's happening with all of these mergers and acquisitions, what does kind of the future kind of look like? And I think what we're finding out is that we have hit rock bottom, but I don't know that we're gonna get out of the bottom just quite yet, like the ladder to get out is just slightly out of reach, and so I think that that's to be determined. Yeah, I will say they're not speaking of where I'm at now, but the one of my favorite things to do is recently, is go to trucker events. And the first thing they come up to me, especially if they know me in the Michigan area, is, you know, your boss, totally, Mark is coming back, you know. So maybe, maybe that, that that will come to an end soon. That would be nice for my social, yeah, the freight recession is not over. Um, unfortunately, we all wish it was. I have a teacher in the other room, Blythe, that says it is so I saw the gravestone. The gravestone said that the recession was over. But it's not we just, you know, come up with new definitions as a country on what a recession is and what isn't. All right. All right. All right, that. That does it for any final words. Are you ready to move on to the the next thrilling topic, as we're talking about data? And yeah, right, data? All right, oh no, I will say though. On that note, I think a lot of what we're going to see though is going to be. Bringing it back to the data of things in this industry, and how are these companies bringing real results to their customers with the data that they can leverage? So I will say, I think that's going to continue to be part of what we see in these moves, for sure, at least on the tech side. Yeah, that's a great way to close out this topic. Thanks for tuning in to another episode of everything is logistics, where we talk all things supply chain, for the thinkers in freight, if you liked this episode, there's plenty more where that came from. Be sure to follow or subscribe on your favorite podcast app so you never miss a conversation. The show is also available in video format over on YouTube, just by searching everything is logistics. And if you're working in freight logistics or supply chain marketing, check out my company, digital dispatch. We help you build smarter websites and marketing systems that actually drive results, not just vanity metrics. Additionally, if you're trying to find the right freight tech tools or partners without getting buried in buzzwords. Head on over to cargorex.io where we're building the largest database of logistics services and solutions. All the links you need are in the show notes. I'll catch you in the next Episode and go jags. You. You